| Debra DeSalvo interview on The Language of the Blues |
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Debra) I got the idea for the book from my conversations with Andrew M. Robble, a good friend and my former boss at Blues Revue magazine. He had been a close friend of Mike Bloomfield and told me some great stories, such as the one I relate in the book about Bloomfield being very freaked out to hear his idol Muddy Waters talking about how much he loved to suck cock...until Bloomfield realized Waters was using a country blues term for a woman's genitalia. I realized that I didn't know the true meanings, let alone the origins, of many of the words and phrases that show up in blues songs. And it seemed that too many books and resources simply quote each other regarding meanings and origins, and that very few authors actually bothered to ask the artists. I resolved to find as many elder blues artists as I could and ask them directly what words like "mojo" and "hoodoo" and "killing floor" meant to them. I had wonderful conversations with everyone from Robert Jr. Lockwood, Henry Gray and Hubert Sumlin to Little Milton, Red Tyler, Smiley Ricks, and Jody Williams. And of course I spoke with many younger artists who are very informed, such as Dr. John, Bonnie Raitt, Jimmie Vaughan, Bob Margolin and the like. David) What's the most surprising thing you learned while researching the book? Debra) I learned so many fascinating tidbits that it's hard to pick just one! Dr. John told me that musicians picked up slang from the lottery business (illegal gambling) in order to give themselves a bit of underworld flair...much as rappers do today. Musicians called their guitars "axes", becuase the lottery men called their guns axes, for example. What I loved was that the lottery men would laugh at the musicians for mis-appropriating their slang (much as today's drug dealers and hustlers find certain "gansta" rappers highly amusing). As Dr. John says in the wonderful foreword he wrote for the book, "This old numbers cat would always shoot ribs at the band about the words we used. He'd say, 'We used all them words, you stupid suckers,and now you're twisting it all up.'" I thought that was hilarious. Another fascinating piece of information was that traveling African Americans, such as Pullman Porters, banked their money at buffet flats, or whorehouses (so called because they offered a "buffet" of sexual activities, from prostitutes to drag and sex shows). They trusted the madams more than the white-owned banks. Perhaps the most surprising fact, as I alluded to above, is that in the blues sexual terms often switch genders. A "rider" can be a sexual partner of either gender, for example, and to bust a nut can mean for a woman or a man to have an orgasm (with "nut" standing for either the testicle or the clitoris). David) Who were your primary sources when researching "The Language of the Blues"? Debra) My primary sources were the many artists I interviewed. Certain books were very important, too, in helping me find connections between African art and culture and blues terminology, especially Flash of the Spirit by Robert Farris Thompson and African Rhythm and African Sensibility by John Miller Chernoff. Catherine Yronwode's Lucky Mojo Web site and Michael Taft's Pre-War Blues Lyric Poetry Web site were also invaluable. David) I particularly enjoyed the fact that this book isn't merely a dictionary of terms, but provides fascinating stories; from the story of prohibition rum-running to the rich history of the crossroads legends to the outrageous tales of Bessie & Ruby Smith. Do you have a favorite story you heard while interviewing musicians for this book? Debra) My favorite story is the one Hubert Sumlin told me about why Howlin Wolf wrote the song "Killing Floor." This is a prime example of the importance of asking the artist--because every book and Web site reports that Wolf wrote that song about the slaughterhouses in Chicago, where many African Americans who came up from the Delta found work. I asked Hubert (Wolf's close friend and long-time guitarist) if that was what the song was about and he said "No, not really, what happened was Wolf had seven wives. One was named Helen. She shot him with a double barrel shotgun with buckshot. Out the second floor window. This woman, oh man, he wrote that song about her!" You'll have to read the book for the rest of the story, which is priceless. David) Did blues music influence you to become a musician and did it influence your recent musical works? Debra) Yes, if I hadn't seen Son Seals play guitar with Koko Taylor, I probably would not have found the nerve to play guitar. I had wanted to play electric guitar since I was very young, but my mom thought it was rather unseemly for a girl and I was intimidated by the speed demons on the radio. One night I went to the Metropole Theater in Milwaukee and saw Son wrench more emotion and intensity out of one note than I'd ever heard from the rockers on the radio. He communicated a whole different musical aesthetic to me in the moment...I realized brilliant guitar playing had nothing to do with speed. It was about choosing the right note to play at the right moment. I figured I could learn to do that. My favorite singers and guitarists are all gut wrenchers as opposed to technicians, although there are some wonderful geniuses who can knock you out with both technique and emotion, and that's the ultimate. I hope that the aesthetic values of the blues shine through everything I do, even when my music is not bluesy. You can hear some straight blues playing in my lead at the end of my song "When It Comes Down," though. David) "The Language of the Blues" obviously (& fascinatingly) addresses the lingo used in blues styles, but doesn't address what separates on style of blues, like Delta Blues or Chicago Blues or Texas Blues or Country Blues or Swing Blues or Acoustic Blues or West Coast Blues or Jump Blues or Folk Blues. Can you comment briefly on these sub-genres...and what style of blues to you like best? Debra) Because I'm an electric guitarist and I'm from Milwaukee, I'm especially fond of electric Chicago Blues. I'm also heavily influenced by great Texas players such as Freddie King and Stevie Ray and Jimmie Vaughan. I do think "genre-fying" music is a mistake too often made by fans...the artists don't categorize themselves. As Little Milton, who grew up in the Delta, gently chided me "You keep saying blues, but back then it was music, period, that was around everywhere." He explains in the book that they all listened to the Grand Ol' Opry on the radio, as well as to Sinatra and the blues played in local jukes. It was all grist for the mill. David) As a musician, who has been your biggest blues influence? Debra) As I mentioned, Son Seals showed me a way into the guitar when I was floundering. Without him I don't know how I would have begun. I dedicated the book to him, as, sadly, he passed away last year before I got a chance to interview him. David) As a writer, how has the music & language of the blues influenced you? Debra) As I discuss in the book, the blues embodies African aesthetic and cultural values, such as generosity, "coolness," humility and maturity. The blues teaches us to pare down, to get to the heart of the matter, to edit ourselves mercilessly. Good values for a writer. Add this page to your favorite Social Bookmarking websites          Add your comment
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